The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

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Thaine
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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Thaine » Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:24 am

We should team up and have a sortie together.
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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Meaker » Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:40 am

Sounds good,just give me a few days to master the 111 and I'll be up for one,maybe we could try out Goat's ACG server,I had a go yesterday and really enjoyed it.
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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Vonhye » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:12 pm

Bombers in BoX are great! But two things bug me:

1) If you jump to your friend's plane, you can't switch gunner positions.

2) Pilot controls the bomb sight and nobody else can. The most fun I had in bombers was in Clod with Woeki as a pilot of Br-20 and me as the bombardier. It is much more immersive when you shout out orders for your pilot that he has to do a few degrees left and right, while he is trying to get the aircraft stable with flak bursting around and Spitfires diving on you from the high '6. In Clod, you work as a real bomb crew, with both players having acces to inmstruments and controls. In BoX, you are just passenger. :/

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Thaine
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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Thaine » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:08 pm

Meaker wrote:Sounds good,just give me a few days to master the 111 and I'll be up for one,maybe we could try out Goat's ACG server,I had a go yesterday and really enjoyed it.
Are you up for a flight tonight? Either 88 or 111.
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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Meaker » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:48 pm

Thaine wrote:
Meaker wrote:Sounds good,just give me a few days to master the 111 and I'll be up for one,maybe we could try out Goat's ACG server,I had a go yesterday and really enjoyed it.
Are you up for a flight tonight? Either 88 or 111.
Sorry,will be out tonight,but I'd certainly be up for some bombing on another night,I'll PM you.
"Ah,tally-ho yippety-dip and zing zang spillip!,looking forward to bullying off for the final chukka?"

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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Frederf » Sat Jan 20, 2018 2:42 am

Things I've learned about the 88:

Departure

Propeller pitch spawns full coarse for engine-off spawn, make sure to set it full fine preferably before engine start or certainly before takeoff. The pitch will be set to 100% for engine-on spawns.

Unless the engine does not start warmed up the cowl flaps must be immediately opened after engine start sequence and only closed at top of climb. The oil temperature, white mark on nacelle gauge, usually suggests cooling even when water temperature, green-ringed gauge inside cockpit, may suggest warming.

Ground handling is hazardous at high power and fast nose rates but docile at minimum power and controlled nose swing rates. Most ground handling difficulties are solved by using less power. Once rolling throttle back significantly to minimum roll. Lower the inside of turn engine instead of raising the outside of turn engine. Brakes provide effective control.

The flaps system includes a variable tail plane incidence as a combined action. The yellow light positions represents only a flap angle increase relative to the green light. The red position increases the flap angle more and significantly alters the tail plane angle producing a nose up tendency. Reserve this last position for final approach when speed is ~200 km/h within a minute of touchdown.

Set yellow light for takeoff in all cases. Aggressively control nose position at start of takeoff roll with taps of toe breaks.

Elevator trim starts severely nose down. Takeoff and initial climb is thoroughly improved by setting pitch trim in the range +50-70% for takeoff.

There is no rush to retract gear after takeoff (<50m). Allow the landing gear to fully retract on takeoff, then reducing to the climb power, then checking the airspeed is sufficient to raise the flaps to the green light position (200-220 km/h), and then commencing any turns.

Steady climb often ~+75% nose up trim. Climb is done at 250 km/h blending to 240 km/h by 6km height further reducing to 230 km/h by the service ceiling. Higher speeds reduce climb rate.

Passing ~2km check manifold pressure decay below 1.25 ata and increase lever to compensate up to supercharge gear change and then reset to 1.25. For high altitude flight adjust lever forward if 1.25 value decays during climb again.

Cruise
Automatic leveler allows accurate transition from climb to level flight but does not change trim. Disconnect leveler in cruise condition to verify and adjust trim to avoid a nasty surprise. Pitch trim in cruise condition is usually 10-25% nose up. Adjust to cruise power after achieving ~300 km/h in level flight under climb power. Cowl flaps can be reduced to about half in cruise.

Required yaw trim is most rightward at high power and low speed reducing to left at low power and high speed. Set ball instrument to center. Roll trim can be set accurately by observing wingtip motion relative to horizon when released from level attitude. Adjust roll balance after yaw trim.

Memory point engine settings:
1.25 2400 climb
1.15 2250 cruise
Set pressure then RPM

Turns require moderate back pressure to avoid descent. Artificial horizon provides a useful reference for turn attitude.

Approach and Landing

Descent is recommended remaining on the vertical speed scale 14-15m/s at 450-500km/h with an engine power of 0.90/2100 although can be made much steeper with less power or use of the air brake. At 8 km/min and -15m/s the glide angle is about 6° or requiring ten times the altitude lost in distance. A descent from 4km to 1km would therefore take approximately 30km or three grid squares. A significant level segment is needed to decelerate at moderate power settings. Cowl flaps at shallow glides with power still require about 1/3rd open.

A circuit at 3-5 km radius around the field at 500m seems appropriate, the flaps being extended to the yellow position on the beam in the range 300-250 km/h, gear extended on or before the base turn 250-220 km/h, and the final flap/tail red light at 200 km/h for the final approach. The engine coolers should be opened fully for the circuit and landing.

Pitch trim of the airplane is practically unaltered between green and yellow position. Red position involves a strong pitch up moment especially at higher speed. Reserve this last position for final approach when speed is ~200 km/h within a minute of touchdown. Avoid pitch trim more nose up more than +0% during the landing pattern instead holding the stick back manually as the movement of the tail plane when set red light provides the desired nose up tendency. If the nose trim is set comfortably for the yellow light setting (~+50%) the airplane will have an excessive and possibly dangerous nose up tendency when the red light position is selected.

Touchdown is at approximately the liftoff speed 170-190 km/h. Below 160 km/h the stick may be pulled full back for improved directional ability. Very little to no engine power is needed for the final 10m of landing.

General
The first stage of instrument illumination is excellent and should be used almost always. The second stage of instrument illumination provides little benefit.

Four fuel tanks are available, 420L each for 1680L at 100%. At 50% or less fuel only the inner tanks have fuel.

Budget 800 L/h maximum or 600 L/h for the cruise segment. At 300 km/h average a flight takes X/5 minutes where X is the flight plan length in km.

The fuel gauge only shows positions 2 and 3 corresponding to the inner and outer tanks respectively. The quantity should be read off the upper scale in 100s of liters. The left and right gauges show the quantity in the left and right tanks for the selected set and should generally match.

Bombing

Set bomb sight as much as practical before takeoff including:
Bomb release quantity (by key or button, UI not functional on ground)
Bomb interval cannot be altered on the ground (calculate, memorize)
Release height (consider target elevation)
Release airspeed (300-350)
Wind speed at release height (interpolated)
Wind bearing for run track (interpolated)
View mode selected
View angle (+70°)
View side angle (match view mode to manual mode, note wind correction angle 2° per mark)

Bomb controls become active ~100 km/h on the takeoff roll.

Autoleveler is automatically engaged when entering the bomb sight. If level flight is not desired quickly deselect by key or button when entering the sight view.

Autoleveler turn keys are available in pilot, bombing, and gunner views up not when looking at the map. It is possible to stick the leveler turn keys on by holding the key, viewing the map, releasing the key, and then exiting the map. The release of the key will not have registered while the map was visible.

Autoleveler turns are very slow resulting in 30km+ turn radius in cruise conditions. If target line up error exceeds a small amount it is preferable to manually fly the correction either bomb sight view or otherwise.

Reference the artificial horizon for turns while in bomb sight view. The sight snaps to vertical for small banks making it a poor visual reference.

Release velocity is ~100m/s so 0.05 0.1 0.25 0.5 interval is about 5, 10, 25, 50m respectively.

The automatic bomb sight angle rate is constant for the release point so it will be much too high on the approach. Let the crosshairs be well beyond the target until the last few degrees when the sighting arm has the thick part before the pointer. Corrections immediately prior to release will be to slightly nudge the aim farther away.

Don't enable auto drop until the target is sighted.

Open the bay doors early for internal releases so allow speed to stabilize.

Adjust power to hit a whole increment on the sight dial but don't chase a round number. If it's 320 and 4.7km enter that into the dial.

Aim prior to the target by half your total bomb stick length. Crosshairs are the first bomb.

Set the view side angle as close as possible to the final solution side angle so changing modes doesn't spoil your aim.

Engage the automatic view mode as soon as possible on the bomb run to show true lateral aiming.

Common target elevations are 50-100m except near sea level on Kuban. Subtract this from your altitude.

Realize that the sight sight look angle left is how much your heading must be skewed to the right on approach. If the wind correction is +10° and track from waypoint to target is 210° then heading will be 220°, and sight will look left 10°.

Relative bearing of wind is easiest to visualize by looking at bomb sight view compass and seeing where the reported wind is coming from. It may be simpler to plan your approach with a direct headwind or tailwind.

Bombs will impact at a trail angle of about -15° on the sight if the automatic rate is allowed to continue after release.

When bombs are depleted the ballistic values are erased and the sight will not calculate bomb solutions or wind correction correctly any more.

The sight can be used to measure distances in interesting ways:
When the sight is 45 elevation the distance to target is equal to the altitude.
When the sight is 60 elevation the distance to target is equal to 1.75x the altitude.
A side look of 6° is 1/10th the slant distance to target laterally.

The sight can and should be used to navigate accurately en route and away from the target area.

Entering a false speed can adjust the automatic crosshair movement rate to refine aim smoothly without using the look farther/nearer binary commands.

Gunners
AI gunners default to long range engagement which is useful for warning but ammo-wasteful. Normal or close range order ensures better gunnery.

The dorsal gunner is one position but two firing points. By selecting the 4th firing point by key press you can choose the firing point directly this way.

Gunner stations remember if you have aimed to gunsight and taken control of gun if you leave and return so they can be pre-set to speed up the process.

The nose gunner makes an excellent vantage point for ground handling.

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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Meaker » Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:07 am

Thanks for that excellent heads up Frederf I will definitely read through,and digest it all :) ,myself and Thaine are planning a sortie over the next few days,so if you want to join us feel free.
Last edited by Meaker on Wed Jan 24, 2018 8:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Kai Lae » Sat Jan 20, 2018 2:08 pm

The 2 important keys are to understand to set the view mode directional offset with the correct wind correction, which is done by making it the same as the manual mode offset. The second is correcting for the height of the target. The aircraft defaults to altitude set to barometric pressure, effectively sea level. Actual target height is probably several hundred meters higher, which will make your bombs fall short. You can compensate for this by selecting the altimeter to display closest airfield height which on most maps should be about the same. My flu addled mind right now is not sure which key is default for that, but I believe it is alt-a.

Also, another thing to keep in mind is that setting the altimeter to display the closest airfield height will only display in the cockpit. The bombsight altimeter will continue to display barometric pressure. This means use the altimeter in the cockpit for your height, not the bombsight altimeter.

Ok there’s a 3rd tip, and that’s to start using http://il2missionplanner.com on every sortie. By doing so you can generally set up the bombsight mostly correctly on the ground, so that you only need to make minor corrections when you acquire the target. This makes things of course way easier because you want to limit the amount of things you need to do on the final run for the greatest chance of success. http://il2missionplanner.com also makes navigation to targets way easier.
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Re: The Ju88 A-4 on BoX a beginners guide

Post by Kai Lae » Sat Jan 20, 2018 2:12 pm

Vonhye wrote:Bombers in BoX are great! But two things bug me:

1) If you jump to your friend's plane, you can't switch gunner positions.

2) Pilot controls the bomb sight and nobody else can. The most fun I had in bombers was in Clod with Woeki as a pilot of Br-20 and me as the bombardier. It is much more immersive when you shout out orders for your pilot that he has to do a few degrees left and right, while he is trying to get the aircraft stable with flak bursting around and Spitfires diving on you from the high '6. In Clod, you work as a real bomb crew, with both players having acces to inmstruments and controls. In BoX, you are just passenger. :/

Both of these have been requested and devs have specifically said they’d like to have the bombsight be operated by a player, but as a “would be nice feature”. In other words, probably not soon.

Gunner you can kinda hack by leaving the plane and rejoining at the desired gun.
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